@antekone Another horrible related thing that's starting to happen a lot is that many email sysadmins are getting lazy when it comes to spam set up and simply rejecting all incoming messages from any mail servers that aren't google, ms etc which helps to cement their monopoly even more 😞

@antekone it also blocks sometimes legit emails from Debian without any reason given. not nice :(

@antekone Gmail sucks, more than ever today. @Tutanota or @protonmail all the way.

@antekone The links the send in the reject messages also point to "help" pages that are not helpful and not telling me what they want to see, e.g. https://support.google.com/mail/?p=IPv6AuthError doesn't mention IPv6 at all...

@antekone The problem with the email service provider market is that people choose their one provider for life. It takes too much time to change hundreds of online (and offline) accounts that have the old address. Most people don’t have a record of who has their email address so they don’t even know who and what needs their new address. This protocol-level vendor lock-in allows for unchallanged abusive policies and hurts competition.

@antekone I agree with you on most points but "pretty much impossible" does not fully match my experience. I manage my own SMTP server and I interact with Gmail people.

@antekone I completely agree! Consider dropping GMail in favor of some smaller provider (not Yahoo or the likes) - there are many remaining and doing a great job in keeping the Internet as open as they can.

@antekone
Yes, definitely. You should drop it.

@antekone Google provides the dominant service in a number of areas now and shows in all of those areas that if you dominate the market you don't need to provide good service. In many cases the main feature they provide over the competition is unlimited space.

@antekone Okay.

For what?

@antekone gmail should have stayed garfield mail

@antekone Bonus, almost everyone bulk drops any "residential" IP.

@antekone
Drop Gmail. Only use for the account here is for login authentication on Google -powned essential infrastructure. The ASB Bank, for example, now insists on a Google account for NFC payments.

@antekone did that yrs ago.

@antekone I switched to Fastmail, but I get spam in my inbox every day now :(.

@antekone is go so far as to say that Gmail isn’t Internet email, and I suspect that their system isn’t even SMTP standards compliant (though I haven’t had a chance to prove that yet).

It’s like any myriad of old proprietary email systems (AOL, Compuserve, etc.), and you’re right, it’s making its users more and more undeliverable.

@antekone Well, I turned that horse around: my mail server auto-responds to mails from Gmail, telling the sender that I won't (and that they should get themselves a "real mail provider" that respects the privacy of their correspondents).

@antekone
Let me say, in my smuggiest voice:

I
Don't
Have
A
Google
Account.
Never
Had.
😎
😎
😎

@antekone outlook.com has similar issues. It blocks whole IP ranges (e.g. the whole Hetzner IP space) and drops or bounces mails from there (sometimes even silenty).

@antekone Goog seems to put emails from SDF accts in to spam now.

This problem is bigger then most realize. Tons of companies now outsource their email to goog (or outlook) because they get tired of fighting to say off blacklists. Just because it isn't "@gmail.com" doesn't mean it isn't powered by Gmail. You can get yourdoamin.com powered by gmail.
Goog & Outlook.com basically run a protection racket today. Hire them for your email hosting or risk having your domain labeled as spam. 😡

@antekone

"Consider dropping GMail." 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

@antekone this happened to me when using Mailbox.org with custom domain. My mails were considered by spam by Gmail recipients.

I managed to solve this with proper SFP and DKIM configuration.

@antekone I eventually want to move to a different mail provider, maybe s9mething like mail.com which is end to end encrypted...

@antekone it's increasingly seeing more adoption among corporates. For commoners, there's nothing better than free

@antekone

This seems a bit hyperbolic. Gmail isn't the reason that self-hosted email servers are increasingly difficult to manage. Spammers and the necessary security responses to them are the reason why most people can't keep up.

@antekone ok but how am I supposed to use a youtube account without it? I mean, I don't primarily use gmail but it's kinda hard to live without google, you know?

don't get me wrong, I'd prefer Google to be abolished all together, or at least have its business model be different, and make its products actually be GPL open source, but that ain't happening any time soon, and for now, Google controls a lot of our lives, and there are no alternatives

@antekone You're so right,delete that shit.I deleted my Google account years ago and haven't missed it a single time.There are so many good,privacy-respecting and free email providers.If you need one,here are the best: https://tutanota.com , https://dismail.de and https://disroot.org

@antekone The Google argument would be: "if everyone just used Gmail, this wouldn't be a problem."
I'm with you on this, but a couple of thoughts: 1) is this also a problem with G Suite email? and 2) What are the best alternatives to Gmail in your opinion and based on what criteria?

@antekone All links are changed to tracked ones as well.

@antekone Protonmail is a good alternative.

@antekone anti spam measures can be discriminating, but gmail is a whole new level💁

@antekone and don't drop Gmail for an Outlook/Exchange Online system: they do exactly the same thing. Any SMTP server that is not run by an ISP or a giant mail hosting company is flagged as spam by default.

This is blatant anti-competitive behaviour, but they will claim it is for our own good.

The reality is that they want to control your data and lock you into the privacy nightmare that their ecosystems are.

It is AOL/CompuServe all over again, only much, much worse.

@antekone
Fuck off #google !

On my side I've been using my own private smtp server for around 20 years now ... And will always !